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Thread: HOT

  1. #1

    Default HOT

    I find it difficult to maintain my position in formation flight, but I think it's because the flight leads (this seems to be true regardless of who's lead except maybe RJ) do not apply HOT once they have established their power setting and because of this they are heavy handed with out realizing it. When you are in position you should not have to power up or down more than 2-5% max on the throttle to maintain you position. You can be flying along and all of a sudden the lead has kick in after burners and you find yourself as must as 2.xx to 3.xx behind, this is due to the heavy hand, how else do you explain this, it's not because of lag/flaps or that you have reduced you throttle settings but rather that the lead has with out noticing increase his throttle setting. How many time do you hearthis call to the lead, what setting do you have, you are pulling away? I think that once the lead has attained his setting he should announce HOT and not change with out letting the flight know. Changes of more than 5% + or - in power or heading should be announced. This is only in a non contact posture, when engaged setting are 100%. Changes of 5-10% the lead could announce Throttle free until he has reestablished his flight setting then go to HOT. Remember those who are following your lead can only guess what your setting are going to be and that will usually end up with you leaving you flight behind. Any input welcome, I may be way off base on this or pretty close. TC

    PS, HOT = Hands Off Throttle. In layman's terms, keep your dam hands off the throttle.

  2. #2

    Default Re: HOT

    Quote Originally Posted by 352ndtoo-cool
    I find it difficult to maintain my position in formation flight, but I think it's because the flight leads (this seems to be true regardless of who's lead except maybe RJ) do not apply HOT once they have established their power setting and because of this they are heavy handed with out realizing it. When you are in position you should not have to power up or down more than 2-5% max on the throttle to maintain you position. You can be flying along and all of a sudden the lead has kick in after burners and you find yourself as must as 2.xx to 3.xx behind, this is due to the heavy hand, how else do you explain this, it's not because of lag/flaps or that you have reduced you throttle settings but rather that the lead has with out noticing increase his throttle setting. How many time do you hearthis call to the lead, what setting do you have, you are pulling away? I think that once the lead has attained his setting he should announce HOT and not change with out letting the flight know. Changes of more than 5% + or - in power or heading should be announced. This is only in a non contact posture, when engaged setting are 100%. Changes of 5-10% the lead could announce Throttle free until he has reestablished his flight setting then go to HOT. Remember those who are following your lead can only guess what your setting are going to be and that will usually end up with you leaving you flight behind. Any input welcome, I may be way off base on this or pretty close. TC

    PS, HOT = Hands Off Throttle.
    Some good thoughts TC

    Quite frankly, for me, the "lead" calling out settings doesn't matter a wit as I have found out through testing that each person's "readout vs actual speed" is different.

    This is probably due to how the manufacturer's joystick sends signals to the sim. I've tested this with others and those involved agreed that even though we all were showing, say for example, 75% throttle, that our instruments and speedbar were showing differently.

    So now I rely on "visuals". If the "lead" is pulling away I increase my throttle until I close on him, and vice versa.

    The only thing that throws me off balance is when the "lead" chops throttle without announcing and I go zipping by.

    Test this amongst yourselves in airplanes with level stabilizer, with a fixed throttle percent and see what happens and what different airspeeds you get for a fixed percentage of throttle.

    Its all in the different sticks we use.

    But keep up the good thoughts on how improve our formation flying.
    Some see the glass as half empty, some see it as half full. I see a glass that's too big.

  3. #3

    Default Re: HOT

    TC,

    You are never right.



    Except this time.

    Right on. Er, OFF. HOT

    Excellent idea.



    Pers

    Ahh, isn't he such an Angel?
    How could you possibly shoot at him?

  4. #4

    Default Re: HOT

    HI
    Thank God its not just me lol .In the same vein however ive noticed that when we are climbing i sometimes find it very difficult to see my own throttle setting against the white sky as the color of the text is white .Is it possible to change the color of our text displays in the config file.? If it is please let me know and ill make the change.
    Thanks Martin/alcorn
    Dam your eyes Adolf ...there goes that bell again !!!

  5. #5

    Default Re: HOT

    Quote Originally Posted by alcorn
    HI
    Thank God its not just me lol .In the same vein however ive noticed that when we are climbing i sometimes find it very difficult to see my own throttle setting against the white sky as the color of the text is white .Is it possible to change the color of our text displays in the config file.? If it is please let me know and ill make the change.
    Thanks Martin/alcorn
    Not that I know of, Alcorn
    Pers

    Ahh, isn't he such an Angel?
    How could you possibly shoot at him?

  6. #6

    Default Re: HOT

    Gents,
    Not to make excuses or anything but as a flight leader, it is very very difficult to fly and trim the P-47 in the sim so that it flies at a constant speed and constant elevation. Once you have the power and prop pitch set to what you think and see will give you a constant speed in mph, something changes and then you are either flying at a faster (slower) speed or your elevation changes. all the while you are trying to maintain course and be aware of the rest of your flight which is trying to keep up while the ensuing flights are trying to catch sight of the group ahead of them.
    Anyone who thinks it's easy, should volunteer to be the flight leader for their FS for an evening.
    The responsibility of the flight leader is to maintain course and speed while at the same time get to altitude all the while attempting to be at a certain place on the map at a certain time so as to make the R/v at the proper time.
    Also we try to allow a rotating basis of each FS to be flight lead so that one isn't "special".
    In each of the missions we have flown for the last few nights, we should have met EA's but we've either gotten there to quick or too late and as a result have not met opposition. I've tested each mission knowing when I'm supposed to be where at what time and they have worked out fine but when we get together with the group to fly them, subtle variations have occurred which caused us to miss the Ea's.
    I've informed Oscar as to when he should be at a certain place at a certain time but then the immersion factor gets reduced. So unless you want me to be the flight leader each mission so that I can assure us of being at that certain place at that certain time and therefore reducing the immersion factor, we face the "fog of war".
    I've had the EA's rotate around a certain R/v, had them meet us early and late within the flight path, attack bombers in the front and/or rear of the box, had them attack multiple places and waypoints of the bomber's flight path, meet us on and off the map and just about every trick I've used many times before, all to no avail so far. This happens because I want the flights to be as close to what happened as is possible. I wanted to allow us to experience what the 352ndFG experienced when EA's attacked from multiple angles at multiple altitudes along a flight path.
    I'll keep on making these missions historically accurate but until we fly them accurately to the second (or really minute) we stand the chance of missing the action.
    The next few missions have bombers and EA's led by more veteran pilots so they should be more accurate but only time will tell if we become more "accurate".

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