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Thread: The Demise of DCS WWII: Europe 1944?

  1. #11
    Administrator wheelsup_cavu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by O'Donovan View Post
    Err, no. 1C is alive and well and releasing games constantly.

    http://www.1cpublishing.eu/

    They're on the team for Battle of Stalingrad, Battle of Moscow, and Battle of Kuban. I'm sure they wouldn't go for working on DCS at this point, since they're so heavily involved in the competition. Still, back in the day, it would have been a possibility.

    -Irish
    1C and 1C:Maddox Games are not the same entity. Just like the partnership between 1C and 777 Studios that created 1C Games Studios are not the same entity. Once those studios are closed the principles of those satellite studios are no longer responsible for anything done to or with their work by 1C.


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  2. #12
    Member O'Donovan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wheelsup_cavu View Post
    1C and 1C:Maddox Games are not the same entity. Just like the partnership between 1C and 777 Studios that created 1C Games Studios are not the same entity. Once those studios are closed the principles of those satellite studios are no longer responsible for anything done to or with their work by 1C.

    Please note that I said, "Truthfully, if ED really wanted to finish the game, all they would have to do is farm it out to 1C." Notice, I didn't mention Maddox at all. As far as 1C and 1C: Maddox not being the same entity, don't believe it. Once 1C bought Maddox Games, it became part of them. Closing 1C: Maddox is as simple as changing the name on the door. All the assets remain the same and 1C can then proceed, with all the same talent, into new ventures. They wash their hands of the bad publicity while operating as usual. It's the same thing "Infinite Games Publishing" did with Mechwarrior Online. They totally mucked it up, then "sold" it to Piranha Games Incorporated. The only thing is, Piranha was the same company; same people and all. IGP was a shell company/subsidiary, built to take the fall, should things go wrong. Even the initials are the same, just reversed, so IGP=PGI. It's pretty common in the game industry to keep going, with a different name, after a disaster. For example, "spinoffs" of PGI have been known as Infinite Games Publishing, Jarhead Games, and Rabbit Hole Interactive, at different times in the past 15+ years. They're the same people, just running different scams.



    -Irish

  3. #13
    Administrator wheelsup_cavu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by O'Donovan View Post
    Please note that I said, "Truthfully, if ED really wanted to finish the game, all they would have to do is farm it out to 1C." Notice, I didn't mention Maddox at all. As far as 1C and 1C: Maddox not being the same entity, don't believe it. Once 1C bought Maddox Games, it became part of them. Closing 1C: Maddox is as simple as changing the name on the door. All the assets remain the same and 1C can then proceed, with all the same talent, into new ventures. They wash their hands of the bad publicity while operating as usual. It's the same thing "Infinite Games Publishing" did with Mechwarrior Online. They totally mucked it up, then "sold" it to Piranha Games Incorporated. The only thing is, Piranha was the same company; same people and all. IGP was a shell company/subsidiary, built to take the fall, should things go wrong. Even the initials are the same, just reversed, so IGP=PGI. It's pretty common in the game industry to keep going, with a different name, after a disaster. For example, "spinoffs" of PGI have been known as Infinite Games Publishing, Jarhead Games, and Rabbit Hole Interactive, at different times in the past 15+ years. They're the same people, just running different scams.



    -Irish
    Actually you did mention Oleg when placing the blame.
    Quote Originally Posted by O'Donovan View Post
    Oleg Maddox/Maddox: 1C Games 10%
    His company and its assets belonged to 1C so it had nothing to do with this project.

    Oleg on the other hand was more personally involved than I initially remembered when I went back and viewed some of the Kickstarter videos on Ilya's YouTube channel.


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  4. #14
    Member O'Donovan's Avatar
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    I mentioned him in the post about DCS WWII failing. Then I specifically left him OUT of the picture when I said ED could contract with 1C to finish DCS WWII. 1C is a major game company with a large number of success stories. They actually translate a large number (about half?) of all English language titles into Russian, for sale over there. On the other hand, Oleg Maddox seems to be a liability rather than an asset, when trying to do something the right way (at least when CloD is concerned).

    I do have a question, though. I've seen the "mods" mentioned regarding 1946 and I know you say you use Forgotten Battles. As they use the same game engine, and use what appear to be the same mods, are they pretty much the same thing, at this point?


    EDIT:
    Quote Originally Posted by wheelsup_cavu View Post
    His company and its assets belonged to 1C so it had nothing to do with this project.
    Yeah, that was a booboo on my part. He had already separated from 1C by that time. Mea culpa. It was him and him alone. That would have made it all the more logical to turn the game over to 1C to be completed, truth be told.


    EDIT of the edit:
    Strangely enough, 1C still has a page on their website for 1C: Maddox Games. Look what I found.

    http://maddox.1c.ru/

    ...and the translation: LINK



    -Irish
    Last edited by O'Donovan; 03-20-2017 at 12:22 AM.

  5. #15

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    Irish,

    As IL-2 evolved from its initial release it became, from IL-2 Sturmovik, to IL-2 Forgotten Battles and Ace Expansion Pack. Somewhere along the line (been years, I've forgotten the details) a separate version of the game was released called "IL-2 Pacific fighters". That version was absorbed into the game in a subsequent update and the game became "IL-2 Forgotten Battles, Ace Expansion Pack, and Pacific Fighters Merged", the version numbers having an "m" added, i.e., 4.10m. At every update, which happened frequently and generally did not carry with it an additional charge (Pacific Fighters did require a purchase) the game engine remained unchanged.

    From the outset to the present day the game engine has never changed. When the file encryption was broken and mods became possible, various portions of the game were able to be tweaked, for better or for worse, but the game engine itself remains original.

    After Maddox and 1c, at whatever positions they had relative to one another (and I don't care, one way or another), left the game to go on to other ventures, a modding group (Team Dedalus) took over "unofficial" updates to the game. I believe TD has now received Maddox's blessing (for all I know it has always had Oleg's blessing) and is creating "official" updates. The game is currently at 4.13 with 4.14 coming shortly (it may actually be out now, as I think about it).

    As a squad we are sticking with 4.12 because the mod package we use, HSFX, has not and apparently will not be updated to work with newer versions. Mods are great but they definitely have a downside for squadron play; they alter the game and unless everyone is using the same game version and mods, the game from user to user, pilot to pilot, is not the same. There was a strong feeling, at the time mods were first available, that modding the game would ruin it for multiplayer use. That feeling was well founded, but packages like HSFX helped keep the game playable as multi-player.

    Say or think what you will about DCS, but if you've ever flown one of their aircraft you immediately recognize that the flight models and aircraft characteristics are getting more detailed and "realistic". Flying a P-51 in DCS is a much different experience than flying one in IL-2 or, for that matter, in Flight Simulator X. By different I mean more evolved, less arcade-like. When CFS 1 came out, M$ proudly announced that the P-51 flight model was "historically accurate", saying actual P-51 pilots verified its accuracy. At the time, that was probably correct, or close to being, given the programming knowledge and hardware capabilities of the era. When IL-2 came out the flight models of all the aircraft were, and still are, vastly different and superior to what M$ had offered. Which was real? Hell, I don't know, but why does it matter? Each is, after all, a game providing a virtual experience and enjoyment of what we each imagine it must have been like to pilot one of those aircraft.

    I see DCS as a clear evolutionary development of the better sims that came before it. Programming these offering must be, has to be, difficult and expensive. There's no such thing as a free lunch, we've been told, although the web has conditioned us to think everything should be free. Critics are a dime a dozen, and some of them are actually right, but in the final analysis I believe the results are best measured by the degree of enjoyment each user can experience.

    I'm looking forward to where DCS WWII goes. I am also willing to be patient to let the developers take their time to get it right. I hope they do; others haven't.
    Pers

    Ahh, isn't he such an Angel?
    How could you possibly shoot at him?

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